I don't think he was overlooked though. My gut feel is he was on parental leave for four whole weeks and appearing as Hose's fielding replacement was his first game involvement back. Of course it does beg the question of why he didn't start that game for Hose - but not going to overthink it. Was he spotted as a replacement fielder earlier in the tournament?
Tayls79 wrote:
I don't think he was overlooked though. My gut feel is he was on parental leave for four whole weeks and appearing as Hose's fielding replacement was his first game involvement back.
I really hope that is the case as I have been eating my own liver throughout the comp watching batsmen who are demonstrably inferior to hain get plenty of time at the crease. My mental health will be much better if it can be confirmed.
Of course it does beg the question of why he didn't start that game for Hose - but not going to overthink it.
I'll do the overthinking for you brother, haha. The suspicion with Hain is that he gets pigeonholed for not scoring quickly enough (partially true, SR in last 3 years 23/24/25 has been 160, 137ish and 147), and also that he takes a while to get his scoring rate up/doesn't score quickly his first 10 balls. I'd argue the latter is often due to him coming in in the powerplay with 2/3 wickets down already and it has been at least partially if not largely situational, also that he clearly has been set the role of batting through the innings whilst others take more risks
but still with all that in his defence, sometimes a batter needs to come in and score pretty much from the off and it hasn't been his strong suit over the years. his BBL 'chance' one year, in the final i think it was, he was at 5 in the order, they didn't lose many wickets overs 1-15 but scored slowly, and with very few overs to go they brought i think 3 players in ahead of him on the basis they were more likely to slog a six or 2 (daniel Sams was definitely one and I would swear Lewis Gregory was another.. fucken Wakeley was in there at the scene of the crime at some point too)
anyway looking at how the Rockets have set up I suspect more angst is in order when they bat him at 6/7 and he doesn't perform the impossible of going at SR300 in the 6 deliveries he has available
but I'm not bitter
He's been available just not getting selected. Apparently he's been sat in the 'dug out' at games with all the gear on.
Also, I don't know if its been mentioned but on social media Warwickshire put a squad up on Saturday night in readiness for Sunday v Somerset and it had Sam Hain in it. This post was removed minutes later I'm told.
Andy wrote:
He's been available just not getting selected. Apparently he's been sat in the 'dug out' at games with all the gear on.
thanks I'm going to lock myself in my bedroom listening to Smiths records now.
FFS no other batsman over 1000 t20 blast runs in the last 2 years and just for one example you've got some **** child called McKinney who's played 10 T20 blast games in his entire life, and literally didn't even score a quarter of the runs Hain got this year, he got 109 runs in 10 games FFS, 109, and he's had one little flourish hit a couple of sixes in 29 runs and the reaction to it, you'd think they were witnessing a peak Viv Richards and meanwhile the most prolific run scorer in the country sits on the bench and, this country, this country, I give in.
ITE7376 wrote:
Andy wrote:
He's been available just not getting selected. Apparently he's been sat in the 'dug out' at games with all the gear on.
thanks I'm going to lock myself in my bedroom listening to Smiths records now.
FFS no other batsman over 1000 t20 blast runs in the last 2 years and just for one example you've got some **** child called McKinney who's played 10 T20 blast games in his entire life, and literally didn't even score a quarter of the runs Hain got this year, he got 109 runs in 10 games FFS, 109, and he's had one little flourish hit a couple of sixes in 29 runs and the reaction to it, you'd think they were witnessing a peak Viv Richards and meanwhile the most prolific run scorer in the country sits on the bench and, this country, this country, I give in.
But finally gets a game for Rockets as replacement for Hose. Batting at 8 behind Moores and Ahmed. Riduculous. Wonder if he'll even get a bat. If so he'll probably be expected to hit 20 off 4 balls.
Grareful for the information provided above. Wonder what he thinks of it all? It could be a good thing for him thats he's realtively close to home with a new baby with minimal work for decent money. Or annoyed at the lack of involvement? Being carded at eight behind Ahmed, Willey and Moores must be a bit frustrating.
Another Warwickshire player twiddling his thumbs! What is it with our players? There seems to be an agenda to prevent them actually playing any cricket!
Tayls79 wrote:
Grareful for the information provided above. Wonder what he thinks of it all? It could be a good thing for him thats he's realtively close to home with a new baby with minimal work for decent money. Or annoyed at the lack of involvement? Being carded at eight behind Ahmed, Willey and Moores must be a bit frustrating.
I can only imagine it to be depressing as **** for him. Looking across the whole tournament there must be at least a dozen batsmen playing regularly, with demonstrably inferior career records, and not just that but nowhere near the runs he has scored this year (he's 9th in the blast tournament)
to be fair to Willey and Moores they have both outscored Hain this year and Moores has got his runs at a better rate IIRC (although Willey has struck at 140 to Hain's 147.......), so, bitter as I am, I can swallow those two. And again with Moores, I'm pretty sure he has a better track record of successfully being able to 'go heavy right from the off' than Hain, plus both Willey and Moores are left handers and the Rockets in particular seem to have an active plan to alternate right and left handers throughout the top and middle order. I'm also pretty sure over a 3 or 4 year period Hain will have outscored both of them by a decent margin. Mind you he scored nearly 100 runs more than Hose at a better SR and Hose still got picked ahead of him...
the ones that really grind my gears are the child Rehan Ahmed (300 runs at 139 vs Hain 440 at 147) and Max ***** Holden (a whopping 229 runs at sR149) ahead of Hain. again, Holden is left handed so that could well be at least partially tactical, but still...........
much of the scouting/selection for this whole thing seems to be along the Bazball 'vibes' lines. This beanpole McKee kid from Durham with 109 runs in 10 games in the Blast, he'll probably get another innings 30 runs with a few sixes some time and get a Big Bash contract off the back of it.
Hain just doesn't give them the 'vibes' is my only explanation
oxfordbear wrote:
ITE7376 wrote:
Andy wrote:
He's been available just not getting selected. Apparently he's been sat in the 'dug out' at games with all the gear on.
thanks I'm going to lock myself in my bedroom listening to Smiths records now.
FFS no other batsman over 1000 t20 blast runs in the last 2 years and just for one example you've got some **** child called McKinney who's played 10 T20 blast games in his entire life, and literally didn't even score a quarter of the runs Hain got this year, he got 109 runs in 10 games FFS, 109, and he's had one little flourish hit a couple of sixes in 29 runs and the reaction to it, you'd think they were witnessing a peak Viv Richards and meanwhile the most prolific run scorer in the country sits on the bench and, this country, this country, I give in.
But finally gets a game for Rockets as replacement for Hose. Batting at 8 behind Moores and Ahmed. Riduculous. Wonder if he'll even get a bat. If so he'll probably be expected to hit 20 off 4 balls.
exactly i can see it now, comes in with 10 balls to go, doesn't perform a miracle, gets dropped as he 'doesn't start quickly enough'.
back to the bedroom and the Smiths records for me, I need to cheer myself up a bit
on the subject of Hundred selections, I don't think Mousley would be anywhere near it if he didn't bowl (AFAIK recall his batting in both years has been absolutely wretched, poor scores and even poorer optics, just looking totally at sea, which he can do not infrequently)
I also have a by-now strong suspicion (it started halfway through the blast) that Mousley's bowling has been found out at the top level (last year his economy was 6.7ish, this year 9.7ish)
I don't think he was bowling well at parts this year, in terms of executing to the field he was set especially. But at what point does 'bowling really fast off 4 steps' become too predictable? apparently it has happened, I reckon. His total lack of ability to deceive in the flight (the trajectory of the ball on the odd occasions when he does try to 'flight' it is the epitome of 'dead duck, gentle floppy loop' and looks entirely easy to predict length on) means his margin for error is nil and the batsman's range of options they have to anticipate is very limited
I'll be surprised if he is a fallback option to bowl his full 4 overs on a consistent basis in future
Hain not playing during August is becoming an annual conversation. I can't blame him doing it for the money but not playing much cricket in his peak years is such a shame.
When I look at some of the duffers on the batting and bowling side, you have to wonder how such a consistent performer at T20, 50-over and CC, can't even get into any first XI.
Re. Mousley, I feel like he leaves us for the Hundread with his game in pretty good shape every year then comes back looking totally out of sorts for the September run in. He either doesn't play or bats 7 and hardly gets a hit or just bowls 5 balls. He'd benefit so much more from playing ODC and batting in the top 4 for us and constructing his innings and also bowling a bit more in different game situations, middle overs etc.
Andy wrote:
Re. Mousley, I feel like he leaves us for the Hundread with his game in pretty good shape every year then comes back looking totally out of sorts for the September run in. He either doesn't play or bats 7 and hardly gets a hit or just bowls 5 balls. He'd benefit so much more from playing ODC and batting in the top 4 for us and constructing his innings and also bowling a bit more in different game situations, middle overs etc.
Yeah I think his bowling would benefit greatly from having to bowl a 'spell' rather than just the occasional opportunistic overs that you get in T20
Club update on Sam:
"Hain, who was named captain of the side for the One Day Cup campaign in the absence of Ed Barnard while he represents SunRisers Leeds in The Hundred, went for a scan earlier this week, with results confirming a knee injury which will see him miss the remainder of the 50-over campaign.
In Hain’s absence, Rob Yates will take over the captaincy of the Metro Bank One Day Cup team. The Club is not putting a timeframe on Hain’s return at this time."
Yet he was "rested" the other day. The club putting out mixed messages or zero injury updates on other players is incredibly poor. The supporters deserve better. Warwickshireis being run like an amateur club these days.
I can see how someone would be upgraded from being a bit sore and rested to then being fully injured. Thing was I think this also happened with Hain last year and then he ended up being away for a while with something undisclosed.
What a wonderful player Sam has been for the Bears!
England selectors over the years, hold your heads in shame!😳
GerryShedd wrote:
What a wonderful player Sam has been for the Bears!
England selectors over the years, hold your heads in shame!😳
This one hundred times over, especially the England part.
I may get slaughtered for this but: is Hain really that unlucky?
Unless i am misremembering badly which is defo possible, he's got 1000 CC runs, what twice is it? aged 31. throwing a name out there you could say someone like James Hildreth got a (much?) higher weight of CC runs without recognition, possibly even much higher he must have got 1000 runs like 7 times or something
hain averaged 35 from 2016-21 i think i read, so you can throw his claim for a test place out for that period. i wouldn't know where he sits on aggregate CC runs since then though to be honest and i think he got more CC runs than anyone else from 22-25?
or take right now, the other question is who does he come in for? Root? Brook? really? given that Root has obviously nailed one of the slots from 3-5 down there's only 2 available and Brook definitely gets one of them in the last 3 years or so, so there's only been 1 middle order slot even available since 2023.
in white ball, 50ovs is his best overall format but the 100 has meant he hasn't had the chance to show it. in my view that's been where he has been unluckiest because like Barnard it seems his game is perfect for the format. anyway considering how good the england team was to 2019 he doesn't get in that team however well he played. pop the 100 in there from 2021 and he's had no chance to prove himself in the format.
T20, for a long time his SR was considered too low, I used to disagree but have leaned more towards that argument, career SR 138 and up to 2021 it was in the early 130s, not good enough for international IMO. he's pushed it on a little since then but the people picked have invariably been scoring at 140 or above, so i can see the logic. also, england won the world cup in 2021 so its difficult to say they should have picked him at that point.
I will still say for T20 there is a slight lack of innovation, and inability or unwillingness to bully spinners, too willing to tick over and let spinners bowl at him, to set himself apart. the best players in T20 won't allow that middle period to just trundle along, much as I love him Hain will do that and has always done that.
he's kicked on his SR since 2021 and if he was ever getting a chance i think it would have been the season he got his ton at Trent Bridge, i think it was 2023? where he seemed to combine consistency with an SR nearing 150 and was visibly playing more aggressively. Its not as though the England middle order at the time was shite or lacking options though
don't want to look like i am deliberately trying to shoot bambi here but if you weigh up his record against the players he'd supposedly replace in the england team, I don't think its a clar cut as him being unjustly robbed of a chance.
shame he isn't an opener as that's where the biggest england weakness has been in the test team and the best opportunity for a while.