I think it's unlikely Bethell will be back this season now. Don't think it makes sense for him to play one red ball game only (whether it be the England test or at Essex) then its 100 and then September is white ball England games. Its all set for him to play 100 then a major part in the England games. I don't mind this. We've just had a game when Mousley and Malik have done alright and should go again.

In any case, I'd really prefer Mouse and Jacob to just concentrate on something. They've been playing 4 formats and both have oscillated between bowling and batting roles. If Mouse just looks to tighten up his batting and Jacob concentrates on white ball, I think we're in a better place. They're both still young enough to add bits to their game later.

Highveld wrote:

It is unlikely that adding an all formats international player would actually weaken the side. Someone does not become a successful international player at Jacob's age, Just 21 remember, withoutout having an exceptional level of ability, and being able to perform even when he hasn't played a lot recently.

Do we really want to repeat the mistakes of "Badbatch"? or continue the rewarding of mediocrity of the Robinson era?

If Bethell is available he should play.

In cricketing terms, it probably is, hence my caveat that people can judge it how they like, but I do like the link to statistical analysis - a bit nerdy on this as is part of my job. Do agree with Highveldt that baseball takes it to the next level while the current Bazball age (in the UK) does seem to reduce the emphasis on data and replacing it with 'vibes' which is far more fun to discuss.

Andy wrote:

This business of taking batters averages but removing the highest and/or lowest scores, then revising the average and then judging the player accordingly is pretty mad, no?!

Yes I more agree with this. What cricket and individuals do is up to themselves, but a valid statistical approach would be to strip out the outliers, so the top two and the bottom two most likely. It's distorting in itself just to remove the highest score.

LeicesterExile wrote:

Isn't the best way to get to a true average batting average is to remove the highest and lowest score and work on what is left.

I get it's been bad and whose fault it is - but what's actually happening? Is it just Shazad getting a lot out of the new ball?

So between Miles and Taz for the final spot? I was looking for Sheikh to get a game to capitalise on his Eng u19s form.

Latham was always going ro miss this because of NZ tesrs in Zim. Reading from this I don't think Bethell will play red ball this season now, probably just plays 100 and Blast, maybe metro bank, to get ready for England white ball in September. I presume Hain is injured but one does worry now.

Two batsmen missing leaves a huge hole. Not sure the bowling is that weak but definitely lacks a bit of a change up.

I'm prepared to believe I have remembered badly for the "pre-Bob" period of his Warks career, clearly he had been given every opportunity, but I am fairly certain when him and Liam Norwell arrived it was Norwell that things were really expected of and that Miles was a 'buy one get one half-price' sort of addition. Either way, I think we're all united in the fact a move probably will work well for him, he's put in the effort and we wish him well. So the important stuff. I also think we agree that some of the first-team and development coaching could be improved just a scootch.

GerryShedd wrote:

I don't go with the view that Miles was only ever seen as a back-up/support bowler. At the time of his signing, he was thought of as one of the most promising young pace bowlers in the country. He made his debut at age 16 and was described by Gloucestershire coach Mark Alleyne as "a precocious talent." For Gloucestershire, he took 255 wickets in 68 first-class matches at an average of 26.68.
Admittedly, that was in the second division; but the potential was clearly there.
So I think that this is another instance where the Bears bowling coaches haven't done a great job in bringing on a young bowler.

Feed commentator says 0.07 behind us.... Basically can't afford to lose against Derby now whereas before today it was theoretically possible to go through with a defeat.

Exiled Bear wrote:

Think Worcs will squeak past us, so a win tomorrow is now definitely necessary.

I was just watching on the feed. A caller said if Worcs get just over 200 (which they just did) and Notts lose with 160 in reply, then that's enough for Worcs to overtake us on NRR with their games played out. Some great hitting by Brookes to get them there.

Both the last two posts are the point of this competition: Development. Agree Kai needs to take the gloves and this is a good opportunity to practice and for Davies to rest from behind the stumps (indeed, if he plays at all). Barnard has also developed in this competition, his run with the bat in 2023 changed things for him massively in his status at the club.

He was only ever signed as back-up, I'm not sure we saw him as an emerging player we were going to develop into high end. As such I wouldn't describe him as poor, but maybe just "Performed as expected".

KingofSpain wrote:

Miles did quite well that one season but 122 wickets over six years in all formats is a poor return. I wish him well and he will be at his level in the second division.
Maybe we can get Singh Dale coming in the opposite direction as an upgrade.

Right. It never seems to work either. I had forgotten about Davies in '23 until Andy mentioned it, but I do remember now that Davies didn't get much output in this period and was somehow out of sorts - which is understandable.

The case, also from 2023 of one team keeping their team together for the final and beating a team who parachuted back in their hundred players tells a story that building a scratch squad quickly but consistently is key to this competition.

GerryShedd wrote:

There is the capacity for players in a Hundred squad but not actually playing to go back to their county for a match/matches; but that just complicates matters further.

Yeah I can remember now. Did he get not many when Barnard got a century in the game versus Durham that year?

Andy wrote:

Tayls79 wrote:

Passed me by that Davies isn't part of the 100. I don't want to start another pile on but was quite looking forward to seeing Barnard / Yates opening as thought that was quite complimentary. Good to see Booth, Hamza and Taz get a run in the side again. Will Bamber do 50 over?

When Davies got released from the Hundred to play ODC for us in 2023 he slotted into the middle order so I think it would be reasonable to expect Barnard and Yates to open the innings again.

Right, NZ have white ball games first against Zim (Presume Latham doesn't get selected for these) starting from Friday and then two tests (which I presume he does) starting 30 July and finishing 11 August. Not sure how long his absence would be. Latham would definitely be a good addition to the Metro Bank squad, even if it is just mentoring a batch of second team players.

GerryShedd wrote:

I think Webster was only signed until the end of July and has since been called up by Australia for their tour of West Indies. Latham was signed for the season but I see that New Zealand have two Tests coming up v Zimbabwe so I don't know if he may be needed for those.
It also looks as if Pakistan are playing T20 and ODI matches in August, which may rule out Hasan Ali.
Who would be a county coach trying to sort out overseas players' availability?

Passed me by that Davies isn't part of the 100. I don't want to start another pile on but was quite looking forward to seeing Barnard / Yates opening as thought that was quite complimentary. Good to see Booth, Hamza and Taz get a run in the side again. Will Bamber do 50 over?

Situation isn't hopeless. A win against Derby gets a QF spot. I can't quite perambulate the situation but maybe even a defeat will do it, all the teams below us have more to do and harder games to play. A QF against Somerset or Surrey might be quite liberating. One thing that's come across after watching the last two games is there is a lack of confidence and assurance - a 'nothing to lose' QF attitude might free them up a bit. If they tense up and play a nervy defeat then it's the same as the worst parts of the Robinson era. And that's an unfortunate reality of the season: Westwood has had no choice but to continue the approach of Robinson this year, he may be able to change a few things over the long close season.

I've seen Davies bat four times this season and he's been out to an impulsive shot outside off stump every time. His reaction has always been the same, aghast, so its not considered or pre-planned. How does he go about solving this bearing in mind it's not in his conscious control?

That is an interesting card. I was first involved in cricket in 1992/93 and there are a lot of players in their heyday on this card who retired when I started watching. Didn't know Adrian Pierson played for us, he was prominent for Leicestershire in one of the first cc games I watched at Edgbaston.

Interesting to see who's got who to play. Looks like we have the easiest run in and with Lancs losing RR against Yorks looks like a real possibility of second. Second or third means Surrey or Hampshire in the quarters... Not sure what to make of that!

I don't think loads short but definitely could have got more. I don't watch that much any more but was only really Hain and Barnard that looked at ease, everyone else was jittery, which I think was exactly the same comment I made on the CC game at Sussex.

Indeed Bethell in for Yates, Yates was originally in for Moeen and Bethell for Mo is a like-for-like. Yates needs to stay close to the squad though, He will need to sub in for Latham when the latter goes to NZ international duty. Good to see England have finally released Bethell. The hawks are circling with Crawley in the test team and Jacob could stand in here (though unlikely to open) but overall Bethell's next international duty is likely to be the England September white ball games so good to get a tune up now, ahead of the 100.

EDIT - indeed, we still need Yates in the side or not enough batsmen. Either way, good to have Jacob back!